23c3

Reply to people on photos

nobody@flickr.com (DracoFlameus) — Fri, 19 Jan 2007 10:10:35 -0800

Scytale, I understand ur argumentation. Of course nobody should get in trouble because he/she is identifiable on a photograph. And for sure I wouldn't call people paranoid, that have serious reasons to be concerned about their privacy.

But then again I can just agree with mitchfoo... we are not talking about photos I made somewhere on a secret meeting or... I don't know... somewhere where nobody would expect to be photographed... I mean... there is even a group here on flickr for that event, u can hardly make it more public.

At the beginning of the congress I was actually unsure wheter or not I could make some photos, but then I saw so many running around with cameras and somebody told me that the whole thing with taking photos is much more relaxed than in earlier days.

And I can't imagine nobody saw me with my photo camera in the hackerbase.. it was not like I was hiding somewhere ;) And actually, I wasn't the only one with a camera there.

All in all I do not believe, that people, who have serious problems will go to a public event, where u can not only be photographed but also be seen by people, because u just can't know who sees u there. It's not like they r asking u there wheter u r from the mafia or doing some kind of invastigation stuff for some organisation. U just buy a ticket and there u go. So if it is dangerous for u to be seen it makes absolutely no sense to go to such an event.

Reply to people on photos

nobody@flickr.com (mitchfoo23) — Mon, 15 Jan 2007 03:03:15 -0800

mitchfoo23 posted a reply:

Well, anybody in the unlucky position of having problems with being photographed should just stay away from public events, shouldn't he?
If you want to go there secretly, wear a mask, otherwise you are in public.

Reply to people on photos

nobody@flickr.com (Scy83) — Sun, 07 Jan 2007 21:21:34 -0800

Scy83 posted a reply:

Is it really that paranoid? Just because _you_ might be in the lucky position of having no problems with people taking photos of you, some others might be in serious trouble if $someone learns that they have been on the Congress (e.g. their employer, some government agency, the mafia). There really are people at the Congress that engage in rather dubious stuff (and possibly stuff that you and me really take advantage of), and you shouldn't judge them as being paranoid, because you don't know why they are that way.

Concerning Antenne's photo mentioned above: There are already rules and laws for photos of crowds of people where you can't really ask everyone. IIRC, if you're taking a photo of the general location and there are more than 7 people on it, it's okay. If you are taking a photo of some thing (an LED cube, for example) or somebody who gave you permission, and another person happens to be on some corner of the photo, this is okay too (German law calls this "Beiwerk"). However, if people are depicted on your photos, regardless of whether they are in a crowd or Beiwerk or whatever, and you didn't have to ask them for permission, they can still come to you and ask you to unpublish that photo. That's a good and important rule, imho.

About the censoring of faces: It's showing that you take privacy concerns seriously, which is a good thing. I'm not really happy with that solution though, because there are some people that can be easily recognized by their clothes, for example. I'm not sure if this is an issue for anybody, though, because you could argue that they should be wearing unobtrusive stuff then.

But there's one thing I'd like to ask the group: I see in DracoFlameus' photostream quite some pictures taken in the Hackcenter in the basement. As far as I know, taking photos there has been a very strict (as in "get the camera ripped out of your hands") no-no the last years. What happened to that rule? Are Hackcenter residents not having problems with it anymore or did just nobody notice DracoFlameus, or what?

Reply to people on photos

nobody@flickr.com (DracoFlameus) — Fri, 05 Jan 2007 01:36:23 -0800

DracoFlameus posted a reply:

I totally agree with u... it IS paranoid =p

However, the guidelines explicitly say that u need the permission... so I decided to ask how serious that is. Don't want any trouble =/

Ur explanation was quite good... it should not point out somebody and every face that could be identified should be censored.

That's what I'll do now... I'll check my photos and censor all possibly identifiable faces. Then it should be ok I guess.

Reply to people on photos

nobody@flickr.com (mitchfoo23) — Thu, 04 Jan 2007 11:34:05 -0800

mitchfoo23 posted a reply:

First of all, I find this whole "Recht am eigenen Bild" discussion totally overrated. While it's certainly true that one's privacy is one of the most important things to protect, people take it way too far in the context of public events with several thousand participants. You can't seriously claim to be there "privately" or in a "private area" when being on a publically accessible event, even more when everybody is a nerd with a digital camera. People start screaming when you point a lens in their general direction from ten meters away, that's simply plain paranoia.

Feel free to disagree with me, this is my personal opinion and people have the right to be paranoid.

But let's look at the picture in question, personal feelings put aside:

- There are definitely a lot of people on this image. Way more than the number of people that would require the photographer to ask every individual for permission.
- There is no single person in the foreground. The image is not manufactured to point out a single person, using the ones in the background as an excuse.
- Get the full resolution image and look closely. Each face that could possibly be recognizable was blurred, which clearly shows the photographer's intent to comply with any privacy concerns.

Conclusion: there is no issue with this image whatsoever.

Reply to people on photos

nobody@flickr.com (benimnetz) — Tue, 02 Jan 2007 15:19:47 -0800

benimnetz posted a reply:

In my opinion, for this picture: www.flickr.com/photos/antenne/339892427/in/pool-23c3/
you don't have to ask for permission, because it would be impossible to ask everybody in the bcc for permission publishing this photo. as long as you don't upload potraits, its okay to publish this photos.
Without that, it would be impossible for photographers to take pictures from any public space.

people on photos

nobody@flickr.com (DracoFlameus) — Tue, 02 Jan 2007 11:02:20 -0800

DracoFlameus posted a new topic:

From what I understand it is not allowed to post any photos with people on it, unless u got their permission.

Some of my photos have people on it (couldn't tell them to get off from the floor or out of the room, so I can make my photo xD)

Looking through the photos however, I saw some with many ppl on it... I doubt, that they all gave their permission (e.g. www.flickr.com/photos/antenne/339892427/in/pool-23c3/ )

So is that an illegal photo?

And if not.. what exactly is an illegal photo?